E15 is here

[mcjaredsandwich]

Originally Posted by 2ndamendment

It can be greatly limited or stopped by electing a new president next year. A president who agrees that this stuff is getting out of hand.

I agree with you.

But in my opinion, farmers who rely on Govt Subsidies for ethanol production (much of the midwest) will not support that candidate. Those farmers are loving the fact they can sell their crop for ethanol production, at a much higher price than for food consumption.

[2ndamendment]

Originally Posted by mcjaredsandwich

I agree with you.

But in my opinion, farmers who rely on Govt Subsidies for ethanol production (much of the midwest) will not support that candidate. Those farmers are loving the fact they can sell their crop for ethanol production, at a much higher price than for food consumption.

There is the base for the problem. The government has over the years introduced the American farmer to subsidies(government Aid---tax payer money). Similar to welfare for the most part.
The corn that is being used for ethanol instead of food, is contributing to the rise in food prices for the American consumer.

[mcjaredsandwich]

Originally Posted by 2ndamendment

There is the base for the problem. The government has over the years introduced the American farmer to subsidies(government Aid---tax payer money). Similar to welfare for the most part.
The corn that is being used for ethanol instead of food, is contributing to the rise in food prices for the American consumer.

A little bit, but not much. Subsidies keep the farmer in business. Without them, we would be paying much more in food cost. We only pay about 10% of our budget on food. Many countries that do not have govt subsidies for farmers pay over 30%, many close to 50%.

The govt buys the crop at a minimum price, assuring the farmer gets paid. If the crop sells for more than what the govt bought it for, the farmer pays back the govt and keeps the profit. If it sell for the same price, or lower than what the govt bought it for, the farmer hands over his entire crop to the govt.

The problem is that we export so much food. Europe and Asia love our grain. But, they also pay for it.

Sure, ethanol is from corn. But its also from sugarcane, and any other crop that can produce alcohol (rice, wheat, etc).

[2ndamendment]

Originally Posted by mcjaredsandwich

A little bit, but not much. Subsidies keep the farmer in business. Without them, we would be paying much more in food cost. We only pay about 10% of our budget on food. Many countries that do not have govt subsidies for farmers pay over 30%, many close to 50%.

Why government is involved in agriculture?
1. Ensure adequate food supply
2. Protect small scale farming
3. Maintain economic viability of rural businesses and communities
4. Minimize dependence on imports
5. Expand agriculture exports
6. Respond to food problems

These days a farmer does not have to grow anything to get federal crop subsidies. The government will send a check based on the amount of product that was grown in the past, even if the farmer does not feel like growing it anymore.


The govt buys the crop at a minimum price, assuring the farmer gets paid. If the crop sells for more than what the govt bought it for, the farmer pays back the govt and keeps the profit. If it sell for the same price, or lower than what the govt bought it for, the farmer hands over his entire crop to the govt.

Government involvement increases the price at the grocery, while going through billions of tax payer money.
In addition, farmers have more accumulated wealth than most urban people in the form of land value.
For most commodities (such as fruits and vegetables, hay, meat products, ornamentals) there is little government income support. Not only that, but the commodities that get no government help are just as profitable as those that do.


The problem is that we export so much food. Europe and Asia love our grain. But, they also pay for it.

Sure, ethanol is from corn. But its also from sugarcane, and any other crop that can produce alcohol (rice, wheat, etc).

What is the rationale for government involvement? Instead what would be the best way government could provide support other than income support?

Here is a quote by Thomas Jefferson;

[SIZE=3]"Were we directed from Washington when to sow, and when to reap, we should soon want bread." --Thomas Jefferson[/SIZE]

[mcjaredsandwich]

Originally Posted by 2ndamendment

What is the rationale for government involvement? Instead what would be the best way government could provide support other than income support?

Here is a quote by Thomas Jefferson;

[SIZE=3]"Were we directed from Washington when to sow, and when to reap, we should soon want bread." --Thomas Jefferson[/SIZE]

~61% of the cost of food products comes from processing outside of the farm.

So if a farmer has land and needs money, he should just sell his land? Just because he has capital in his land, does not mean he has money in his pocket.

[2ndamendment]

Originally Posted by mcjaredsandwich

~61% of the cost of food products comes from processing outside of the farm.

So if a farmer has land and needs money, he should just sell his land? Just because he has capital in his land, does not mean he has money in his pocket.

Answer --- No

Back to the original question. Why is government still involved so deeply and why are we being forced to use ethanol?

Will be interesting for the next 11 months, to see just what environmental regs are put out before the current administration is out. Why just today it was disclosed energy producers will be restricted even further. In the end a lot of people will lose there jobs because coal plants can not produce and oil can not flow with this administration.

[Montauk17]

Originally Posted by 2ndamendment

Answer --- No

Back to the original question. Why is government still involved so deeply and why are we being forced to use ethanol?

Will be interesting for the next 11 months, to see just what environmental regs are put out before the current administration is out. Why just today it was disclosed energy producers will be restricted even further. In the end a lot of people will lose there jobs because coal plants can not produce and oil can not flow with this administration.

I sure hope we can get a new administration in and reverse everything. Jamming all these new unconstitutional acts are ruining our way of life and freedom. It's almost like they are trying to get we the people to fight back. Government was put into place to protect liberty,not line politicians pockets for their entire lifetime.

[weedeater]

Originally Posted by 2ndamendment

There is the base for the problem. The government has over the years introduced the American farmer to subsidies(government Aid---tax payer money). Similar to welfare for the most part.
The corn that is being used for ethanol instead of food, is contributing to the rise in food prices for the American consumer.

Just like welfare, foodstamps and Obama mama money is helping out in our unemployment numbers, the more free crap you hand out the more people and animals stand in line for a handout instead of a line looking for a job.......

[mcjaredsandwich]

Originally Posted by weedeater

Just like welfare, foodstamps and Obama mama money is helping out in our unemployment numbers, the more free crap you hand out the more people and animals stand in line for a handout instead of a line looking for a job.......

Are you saying farmers don't work? And that the govt assistance they do have, they sit on their ***? They're some of the hardest working citizens in the U.S. sometimes 16 hour days for minimal profits.

[weedeater]

Originally Posted by mcjaredsandwich

Are you saying farmers don't work? And that the govt assistance they do have, they sit on their ***? They're some of the hardest working citizens in the U.S. sometimes 16 hour days for minimal profits.

no I don't mean the farmers I know they work hard, the ones that I am talking about or the others that draw free money. I have seen a farmer where we hunted plant crops and 3 of 6yrs not get any harvest but he also carries insurance to help out with this, I don't understand the deal with the farmers that are paid not to plant "CRP" but from little I have been told on this it ddont make much sense to have good farm land and pay a guy not to plant...... maybe someone can explain this alittle more